Transcript of Frankel's Free Clinic Sepetember 2, 2002

RobFrankel (9/2/2002 8:08 AM): Yes, even though it is a holiday in the USA, I will be here in about 50 minutes from the time of this post for a Free Clinic today. Grab some coffee and I'll meet you back here at 9:00 AM pacific coast time (9/2/2002 8:29 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:00 AM): Entered the room.

Greg (9/2/2002 9:00 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:00 AM): Although I don't expect a ton of people here today, I am officially open for business!

Stuart Bruce (9/2/2002 9:01 AM): Entered the room.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:01 AM): Entered the room.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:02 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:02 AM): Greetings, folks....who

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:02 AM): Hello all.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:02 AM): Who's up first today?

Stuart Bruce (9/2/2002 9:02 AM): Hi, Rob.Thought I'd take a look and bump up the numbers on Labour Day.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:02 AM): Hi Rob...and business you ARE doing...after some time lurking and evaluating your advice...I just subscribed to FrankelTips...

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:03 AM): I don't know who's first, but I'd like to put myself into the queue.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:03 AM): Hi Stuart. That's funny. The clinic numbers usually are low, but the big USA holidays seem to be when we get some of our shyer people to come out.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:03 AM): Thanks, Lyman! You'll find it very helpful.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:03 AM): I have a question re: talk radio, may I take a number?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:03 AM): Pat, you can go first if you like

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:04 AM): Lyman, you're after Pat

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:04 AM): Thanks, Rob. I took a hard look at my slogan on, and came up with something that's not a "fact", but something that's more appropriate. I'd like to know your opinion on it.

Peter Cooper ( (9/2/2002 9:05 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:05 AM): you want to give us the URL?

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:05 AM): Oh, ok.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:06 AM):, I assume?

weber (9/2/2002 9:06 AM): Entered the room.

John Charlesworth ( Professional Web Tracking) (9/2/2002 9:06 AM): Entered the room.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:06 AM): Yep

weber (9/2/2002 9:07 AM): Rob I need some advice, I'll wait

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:07 AM): Okay, pat, I'm there

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:08 AM): Okay Weber, you'll go after Lyman

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:08 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:08 AM): what's the deal, Pat?

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 9:08 AM): Entered the room.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:08 AM): I would like to know if the slogan makes more sense than the previous one. I'm a specialist in several areas, but I don't want to the Web site to concentrate a single thing.

Stuart Bruce ( (9/2/2002 9:09 AM): Entered the room.

Jodie ( (9/2/2002 9:09 AM): Entered the room.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:09 AM): The last slogan concentrated more on e-commerce security as opposed to an e-commerce site not being complete without security. Does this make sense?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:10 AM): Pat, do you mean "Your complete e-business solution for the 21st century.?"

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:10 AM): Yep

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:11 AM): I was thinking of dropping off the last part "21st century", but then it wouldn't sound too original, in my opinion.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:11 AM): Nope, it's wa-a-a-a-a-a-y to broad. And more importantly, it doesn't say anything specifically about how you're the only solution. Pat, this line is a claim that's many people can -- and do -- make.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:12 AM): You really need to lead with one aspect. The others will follow once you draw them in with your main brand attribute.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:13 AM): If you want to be the security experts for e-commerce shops, that's one thing

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:13 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:13 AM): Or if you want to be "offering the most secure e-commerce sites on Earth" that's another.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:13 AM): Ok. How does one write a one-sentence slogan that says they are the only solution to their problem? I thought this was not possible and it shouldn't be done.

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:13 AM): Pat - 'complete' in your slogan doesn't seem to show that you're offering a single, integrated solution - it seems more like you handle all aspects of the business

Jodie ( (9/2/2002 9:13 AM): Hmmmm - you're "e-complete"

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:14 AM): Pat, you have to start by writing the most boring sentence that articulates exactly why they should choose you. Don't make it clever. Just make it right. If you need to take five sentences to do it, that's okay. You can always whittle them down. but get it on paper first.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:15 AM): Jonathan, what do you mean? The part I'm handling is the online portion of one's business, unless their entire business is online. For example, I have a few brick-n-mortar clients that are extending their business online.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:15 AM): Also, avoid overused words like "Complete". That kind of language is sales-ese. It falls on deaf ears. It's been promised too long by too many.

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:15 AM): Pat - is this a turnkey solution or a totally customized one?

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:16 AM): Jonathan, totally customized.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:17 AM): Jonathan - It's not a package that you buy out of the store or online.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:17 AM): Rob - Originally, I had the word "professional" in the slogan, but I decided to take that out because everyone claims to be professional.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:18 AM): If it's customized, why don't we hear anything about that?

Greg (9/2/2002 9:18 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:19 AM): Seems to me that would be a great selling point..

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:19 AM): Rob - to use the word "professional?"

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:21 AM): NO, to use the word "Customized" or at least that concept

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:21 AM): (Sorry didn't mean that all caps thing)

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:22 AM): Pat, how about starting your home page out with a pop-up interactive survey that asks a couple of low-commitment questions, like:

Jodie ( (9/2/2002 9:22 AM): just brainstorming... e-commerce. e-security. easy e-commerce, e-customized e. customized.

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:22 AM): No problem. I thought you were emphasizing that using the word "professional" is taboo.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:22 AM): Lyman, let's move on to your question, because we have Weber after you. W can come back to Pat in a bit

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 9:23 AM): Oh dear - from all I hear, most people dislike popups of any sort for any reason]

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:23 AM): Welcome! To give you PERSONALIZED free introductory help by sending you to the right area of our site,

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:23 AM): Sorry, didn't mean to take up too much time.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:23 AM): okay, thanks here it comes:

Pat ( (9/2/2002 9:23 AM): Lyman, people don't like popups, and I don't like them either, so I decided against them.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:23 AM): I am still furious (and there are millions like me) about the U.S. Pledge of Allegiance being ruled "unconstitutional" and am doing something about it. I have a classic car I am having painted Red White and Blue. I found the Calif. DMV personalized plates I PLEDGE were not taken and have them reserved and on the way to me. I'm planning a PLEDGE DRIVE from San Diego up to San Francisco mid-October to PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE at the courthouse where the Pledge was declared unconstitutional....want to have at least 10,000 cars in a motorcade and a Million Person Pledge there and also in the Capitol Mall in Washington, D.C. Talk radio is a likely way to promote this event and to get sponsor inquiries to help underwrite this project. I'm seeking public relations help (Sunni, are you out there today?) and sponsorship sales. I am developing a Web site but it's not up yet. Suggestions? Contacts? Sponsor leads? Talk Show hosts you know personally who would get behind this? John & Ken of KFI did a SUV tax motorcade a month ago--this is MUCH bigger.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:24 AM): Lyman, this really isn't a Free Clinic's a post for FrankelBiz.

Greg (9/2/2002 9:24 AM): Entered the room.

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): Bill O'Reilly at

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): okay, I'll go there and also post an ad or two....

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): As long as it's a BUSINESS issue. Remember we don't do social or political issues here. This is for business.

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): Lyman - there are a couple of web sites where you can register as a guest with a specific area of interest/expertise, and radio shows use them as sources.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): the sponsorship part is definitely business/commerce

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): So I guess it wouldn't fly on FrankelBiz, either. I really meant to say FrankelTips, where I can answer it in a broader forum

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:25 AM): Lyman, e-mail me off list, and I will give you lots of conservative contacts.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:26 AM): Okay, Lyman, if there's a real business issue there, let's isolate that.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:27 AM): What's the real question there? What's the advantage for sponsors?

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:27 AM): I also want to know about hot to get sponsorships.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:27 AM): You realize that when it comes to sponsorships, politics and religion are like playing with dynamite: You risk alienating as many people as attracting.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:28 AM): my car will be the Pace Car, like an Indy 500 pace car. Sponsors who want to Rally 'Round The Flag to their targeted audience will be able to purchase sponsorships on the mobile billboard(s) and the Web site. Also some patriotic merchandise is under development, partly for Ebay sales and partly for direct viral marketing...

Peter Cooper ( (9/2/2002 9:29 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:29 AM): Yes, but what is the benefit for the sponsoring brand? How does it pay out for them?

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:29 AM): Do a web search on Google under "patriotic".

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:30 AM): If I'm going to sponsor an event, I want to do so with an objective in mind. What are you delivering to the sponsors? And how does that translate into business for them?

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:30 AM): I don't mind alienating flagburners and pledgehaters....I'm talking about AMERICANS...87% in one poll recently backed leaving the Pledge as-is. Those are good enough numbers for me and the sponsors who want to stand with traditional American values--which is just about everyone--at least in lip service....

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:31 AM): If the car has the sponsors name on it, isn't that like a billboard?

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 9:32 AM): but where is the business benefit for sponsors?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:32 AM): Sorry, kids, you can parade motherhood and the flag and George Washington all you want. But if you're talking about selling sponsorships, you better come up with a rationale on why a businessman would want to put down cash.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:33 AM): Anita, it might be a billboard, but you can paint the side of a cow in a pasture and call that a billboard, too.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:33 AM): Lots of people drive by it.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:33 AM): But it doesn't mean it's effective advertising with a proposed ROI.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:34 AM): Rob, you may not have researched this as much as I but there are MILLIONS of people very angry and I am giving them a focal point, an action plan...sponsors want to BRAND favorably with their target audiences....Anita, yes, but instead of ton of sponsor stickers/logos like on Indy/Formula cars, the tractor/trailer(s) with the company names is where the sponsor names will go plus the Web site...

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:35 AM): Lyman, you still haven't answered the question. I see why you want to do this. But you're politically motivated. Your sponsors want to know that they'll make money by sponsoring you. What are you telling them in BUSINESS not political terms

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:36 AM): If you say, "Pay $5K" for my car and X number of people will see it?

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:36 AM): In this case, I believe it's much less a tangible ROI issue than normally is and should be. Sponsors are hereby making a statement about core values, etc...this is so emotion-laden that it cannot help but be a "Image" branding issue....

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:37 AM): That's a great question re: "pay $5k/number of people seeing it" working on the media kit...

weber (9/2/2002 9:37 AM): IMHO, they can get the same by putting an American Flag on their product label

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:38 AM): Well, that's where you may find yourself in trouble, Lyman. I don't know of one brand (no matter how political) that spends money purely for ideological purposes. Those ideologies may be part of their brands, but their businesses are fueled by cash, just like everyone else's.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:38 AM): Weber, you're right, although Lyman has the Pledge of Allegiance specifically in his sites.

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 9:38 AM): I cannot see any business benefit here at all.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:39 AM): of course there is a related financial tie-in...all sponsors will have eCommerce links to their Web sites from mine and in my related Newsletters...

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:40 AM): Lyman, your timing may be late, as well. Lots of pro-pledge folks timed their events to coordinate with the anniversary of 9/11. You also have to be careful of mixing theology with patriotism. Even the most conservative businesses shy away from that

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:40 AM): unless you go after flag manufacturers and the like :)

weber (9/2/2002 9:40 AM): Lyman, so if I was selling flags, or 9/11 pins, or Statues of Liberty it would make sense to advertise in your newsletters and web site, but not 5K on a truck.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:41 AM): Lyman, unless you've already got tens of thousands of subscribers and parade enthusiasts, you have a tough sell. Remember that sponsors want targeted audiences and lots of bodies in those audiences.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:41 AM): Weber, you want to go now?

weber (9/2/2002 9:42 AM): Rob, that's what I was saying in my typical roundabout way.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:42 AM): back to my original talk radio question--who out here knows some talk radio hosts? Anyone? I already have one newsletter publisher (50,000 circ) that is planning to feature this in an issue soon.

weber (9/2/2002 9:42 AM): OK

weber (9/2/2002 9:42 AM): I know this is also a question for FrankelBees, but I am wondering if you know if there is a specific contract for freelance writers

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:43 AM): thanks for the input all, would welcome more feedback offline.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:43 AM): What issues concern you other than the normal terms of service?

weber (9/2/2002 9:44 AM): Plagiarism, they sign over the rights to the articles

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:45 AM): Weber, are you seeking to be a freelance paid writer or to publish the articles as free promo for print books, speaker's circuits, etc.?

weber (9/2/2002 9:45 AM): This is for a new ezine, and I don't want what we have being the exact same as everyone else. And I am also concerned with the lawsuit happy world that someone will claim it is their article.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:45 AM): Weber, there's an e-book I have that's actually a couple of MS WORD templates for service agreements. You can search and replace them. They're pretty good. One of the point in there spells out when (if ever) the materials contracted for become the property of the buyer.

weber (9/2/2002 9:46 AM): That should have been lawsuit not laysuit

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:46 AM): weber - it's called a work for hire agreement

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:46 AM): take a look at for an example

weber (9/2/2002 9:46 AM): Boy is my spelling going downhill.

Jonathan Cohen ( (9/2/2002 9:46 AM): also includes a bit explaining that the writer must have copyright to all of the work (except where s/he's quoting for 'fair use')

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:47 AM): Check and for contracts. Also may have information on this.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:47 AM): Your spelling is fine. Your typing sucks. Join the club.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:47 AM): has some useful language and you keep your rights.... be sure you learn more about the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office (U.S. PTO) ... suit yourself (grin)

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:47 AM): BTW, what's the big deal if someone DOES copy your stuff?

weber (9/2/2002 9:47 AM): Thanks.

Michael ( (9/2/2002 9:47 AM): Entered the room.

weber (9/2/2002 9:48 AM): Well, if I am selling subscriptions, then why would anyone want to buy my stuff it they can get it elsewhere?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:48 AM): You've got to figure, that on the web or off, if someone wants to steal what you've got, they'll figure out a way to take it. So just don't put anything out there that you couldn't stand to have ripped off.

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 9:49 AM): I was very impressed with the attitude of Dr,Wayne Dyer, who invites people to copy his stuff and tape his speeches. He says, Nothing but good can come of it.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:49 AM): Weber, I face that problem all the time. Who knows how many people rip of FrankelTips or my e-books?

weber (9/2/2002 9:49 AM): I will be competing with print media on this Ezine. SO since I am new, if I have an article in the zine, and a print competitor has the exact same article(s) why would anyone want to buy from me?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:50 AM): As I wrote in FrankelTips a while back, if they steal it, it's an indication they want what I got. Also, it's more free advertising.

weber (9/2/2002 9:51 AM): I'm not concerned at this point about someone ripping off the stuff in the ezine, I am concerned about I pay for an article, and then the writer also submits it to 3 or 4 competitors and everyone runs the same article.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:51 AM): I should mention that I have no stats on this, but as long as the expense of guaranteeing single issue delivery is high, nobody is going to waste time policing this stuff. It's much easier to change our attitudes than technology -- or evil people's ways.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:51 AM): check out for an excellent example of giving away a little "teaser" content and selling the rest for big also can work with smaller-ticket subscriptions...ZDNet/CNET is experimenting with a $7/month model...

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:51 AM): (TEN MINUTE WARNING)

weber (9/2/2002 9:52 AM): This is initially going to be priced at $24.00 per year and come out monthly.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:53 AM): Look at how long and hard Rob has had to work to earn MY $24/year...and I'm definitely a satisfied customer who will buy repeatedly....

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:53 AM): My thinking is that if you charge a subscription fee, the people who pay will pay. I haven't yet heard or seen anything about my stuff getting ripped off and republished. And there's a lot of my stuff out there.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:54 AM): Entered the room.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:54 AM): I guess what it comes down to is that there's always going to be waste and spillage. But the big fear of people ripping you off is largely overrated. most people have better things to do with their time. Even at $24 a year, that's not enough to steal for.

weber (9/2/2002 9:55 AM): Again, it's not the subscribers I am worried about. I just don't want the ** exact same ** stuff in competitors work.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:55 AM): Lorilyn! Good to see you I owe you a banner or something?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:55 AM): NTW, Lyman, Lorilyn has a site that features guests to be interviewed on radio.....

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Weber, if you do have it in their publications, don't forget it is called "syndication" and can be VERY are the wholesaler then!

weber (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): For example, I pay a freelance writer X amount for an article. Then they sell the exact same article to a competitor down the street. That is what I am worried about and want to protect against.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Rob, no. :) I always remember this an hour ago. Then forget.

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Weber, there are two billion plus websites out there. Are you going to police them all?

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Oops. Should have been "BTW"

weber (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Regarding Plagiarism, I don't want a writer submitting someone else's material as their won, and then getting sued for it.

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Hi Lorilyn...I'll touch base offline later today.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:56 AM): Rob, you need a two-hour chat.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:57 AM): Right Anita. Better to take the attitude of Free Reprint. You can see mine at I think/////

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:57 AM): Lorilyn, one hour is as much as my fingers can take!

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:57 AM): I wrote an article and it was reprinted all over. It was great. I just insisted the identifying paragraph at the end be included.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:57 AM): That's my Free Reprint Policy. And believe it or not, a lot of folks do write in and ask permission.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:58 AM): Right, Lorilyn. I also ask them not to change the content.

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 9:58 AM): Lorilyn, try reminding yourself 2 hours before the event.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:58 AM): Mine was about giving radio interviews and ended up in a national NURSING magazine.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:58 AM): (TWO MINUTES)

Anita ( (9/2/2002 9:58 AM): Most freelancers want the identity box at the bottom. That way people know who wrote the piece.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:58 AM): As well as other places.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:59 AM): Enough time for me to say "See you next week!'

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:59 AM): Wow. That was a long, weird summer. Hopefully, the USA will wake up after Labor Day (9/11 ceremonies notwithstanding) and get back to work.

weber (9/2/2002 9:59 AM): Lorilyn, I have no problem if I am writing for publicity, but NOT when I am paying for exclusive use of an article. Anita, every article gets a by line, and other info regarding the freelancer. That is no problem

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 9:59 AM): It was a long weird year. Shortest one in my life. Seems 9/11 was last week.

Rob Frankel ( (9/2/2002 9:59 AM): Okay, everyone have a great week and thanks for this session today. I'll see you online!

Stacey ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): Entered the room.

Lorilyn Bailey ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): Weber, understood. Too many take advantage of writers.

Anita ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): Hey, I'm swamped.

Frederick ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): TTFN

Lyman Stucky ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): Rob and all, THANKS for the input and I'll be in touch later today, Anita and Lorilyn

Anita ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): Whoops! See you online!

Pat ( (9/2/2002 10:00 AM): Take care everyone.

weber (9/2/2002 10:01 AM): Take Care

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